Modified:
28 Feb 2010
by Dhc

Vote totals:

Yes:

56%

No:

44%

Neutral:

0%

 
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DEBATE: SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?

In his column on the BBC's website Professor Terence Stephenson has called for parents to be stopped from smoking in cars. If his calls were enacted it would be the latest in a long line of restrictions passed on smokers. But is it time to do away completley with the tradition of having a "ciggie" so to speak and ban nicotine altogether





SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?


Eliminates a public health menace


Let's face facts smoking is a public health hazard whether it's passive or done directly. With regard to smoking the damage done to lungs and other internal organs in the form of cancer and other diseases is well documented , not to mention premature aging. Passive smoking also causes problems in that as well as causing lung disease and heart cancer if done over a long time, it also reducing the functions of lungs of people with asthma as well as causing eye problems and increased sensitivity.[1] . All of this costs the National Health Service an estimated £2.7 billion in try to deal with all the smoking related illnesses as well as hitting the UK workforce in terms of lost productivity.[2]

It's a dangerous drug and it's high time it was treated as a narcotic and banned
  1. ^ ASH "Smoking and disease" http://www.ash.org.uk/files/documents/ASH_94.pdf Accessed 19.06.09
  2. ^ http://www.ash.org.uk/files/documents/ASH_95.pdf

Smoking is a hazard but its effects are massively overstated by the smoking lobby. For instance although lung cancer affects "0.01"% of non smokers smoking increases the likelihood of a person who started smoking in their teens have a chance of developing lung cancer at 2% if they stop at 30 and 16% if they stop at 70[1] Also smoking could potentially help protect against Alzheimers disease as well as reduce stress something that can cause just as much serious problems for people as smoking does.[2]

Secondly it pays its way so to speak, the UK treasury gets an estimated £8,000 million from revenues that's money that can go towards hospitals schools etc[3]. Why take away a good source of revenue that can help?
  1. ^ Forest "Smoking and Health"http://www.forestonline.org/output/Smoking-and-Health.aspx Accessed 19.06.2009
  2. ^ Forest "Smoking and Health"http://www.forestonline.org/output/Smoking-and-Health.aspx Accessed 19.06.2009
  3. ^ Ash http://www.ash.org.uk/files/documents/ASH_95.pdf Accessed


What do you think?  Vote on this point below.
Absolutely Yes
Strongly Yes
Mostly Yes
Partially Yes
Neutral
Partially No
Mostly No
Strongly No
Absolutely No

SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?


Being regulated out of existence anyway


In the UK the tobacco industry are running out of ways to advertise and sell cigarettes anyway and people are running out of options to smoke them. For example tobacco companies can't advertise or sponsor events or teams etc. They can not sell cigarettes to people under 18 . Also people can not smoke in most "enclosed" public areas or workplaces with a few exceptions. Not to mention the major warnings on cigarette packets that companies are compelled to put on by the Department of Health[1]. In fact Liverpool City Council are proposing to give newly released films depicting people who smoke an automatic 18 classification over riding what ever classification the British Board of Film Classification may have for that film.[2]

Given these restrictions isn't it time to give it the final legal kiss of disapproval and ban them completely?.
  1. ^ Ash "Ash facts at a glanceTobacco regulations"http://www.ash.org.uk/files/documents/ASH_96.pdf
  2. ^ BBC News "Smoking Actors to be rated 18" http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/merseyside/8105585.stm

Just because something is heavily taxed and regulated doesn't make the activity wrong and the regulations on it working it right. The high taxes on smoking force people some people to buy illicitly whether in the form of smuggled cigarettes from France something that hits the treasury to the amount of £2 billion a year or fraud cigarettes.[1]
  1. ^ Action on smoking and health (ash) "Facts at a glance " [[http://www.ash.org.uk/files/documents/ASH_95.pdf


What do you think?  Vote on this point below.
Absolutely Yes
Strongly Yes
Mostly Yes
Partially Yes
Neutral
Partially No
Mostly No
Strongly No
Absolutely No

SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?


Class exploitation


Smoking and the industry just like the narcotics industry are a form of class warfare. As tobacco advertising is being banned in the UK companies are heading towards less economically developed countries exploiting the people in search of profits. This is adding to a figure of five million people who die worldwide each year as a result of smoking and is yet another strain on a continent that has enough problems to deal with HIV or Aids[1]
  1. ^ BBC News World Africa "Why do we still smoke in Africa "http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/4361837.stm Accessed 19.06.09

The Health secretary who was present when the ban was enacted, John Reid famously said it "was wrong for middle class politicians to ban what for many working class people was their only pleasure".[1] This means an outright ban on smoking far from being an act of liberating people would be tightening the screw on an already strained working class by a puritanical middle class nanny state.[2].
  1. ^ http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/3789591.stm
  2. ^ Patrick Wintour http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2005/oct/27/smoking.health1


What do you think?  Vote on this point below.
Absolutely Yes
Strongly Yes
Mostly Yes
Partially Yes
Neutral
Partially No
Mostly No
Strongly No
Absolutely No

SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?


YES.


Smoking does not just effect the smokers health, it effects the people around them. Just because they want to damage their health doesn't mean they should damage ours.

That would certainly be an argument for regulating the circumstances in which people can smoke, like, for example, the law in Ireland that bans smoking in enclosed workplaces. But so long as smokers don't "smoke in someone's face" then they should not be prevented for enjoying a cigarette if they so choose.


What do you think?  Vote on this point below.
Absolutely Yes
Strongly Yes
Mostly Yes
Partially Yes
Neutral
Partially No
Mostly No
Strongly No
Absolutely No

SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?


Damaging health


Smoking is a very bad habit.It has many bad side effects.it causes many fatal diseases like bronchitis,liver cancer,blood cancer, breathing problems etc.which can kill people.It also causes heart related diseases.It makes infections in the internal side of our body.Because of it, every year about 50,000-1,00,000 people dies in the world.It has tobacco in it which is very very dangerous for human health.Sometimes it gets harder to breathe for the smokers.It also can be dangerous for the friends & family of a smoker.As a Substantiation we can take the matter of Hafiz who is a student of CTG. university.(-THE DAILY AJADY)..He died of cancer last year because of smoking.Smoke made his liver infected.So he died with an unbearable pain.Like Hafiz there are so many people are dying.So we should take necessary steps to make people live.We should make smoking illegal. Cigarette smoking causes 87 percent of lung cancer deaths[1]
  1. ^ http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/tobacco/cancer

It is the case that smoking is an unhealthy habit, and that it harms the smoker and those physically close to the smoker when they are smoking. But that's no argument for a government-enforced ban on smoking. Eating fast food is unhealthy, so is it up to the government to shut down all fast food restaurants? Drinking alcohol is unhealthy, and many innocent bystanders are harmed as an effect of drunk behavior (drinking and driving, drunken arguments, etc), is it up to the government in that case to eradicate all alcohol from the country? Of course not. In all of these cases, it is up to the individual to make the decision for their own health. As for preventing secondhand smoke, smoking regulations enforced by the government, ie smoking is not allowed within 50 feet of a public building or inside the workplace, etc, seem to be a good idea. But there's no need for complete government control of tobacco products/cigarettes.


What do you think?  Vote on this point below.
Absolutely Yes
Strongly Yes
Mostly Yes
Partially Yes
Neutral
Partially No
Mostly No
Strongly No
Absolutely No

SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?



What do you think?  Vote on this point below.
Absolutely Yes
Strongly Yes
Mostly Yes
Partially Yes
Neutral
Partially No
Mostly No
Strongly No
Absolutely No

SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?


Can cause Lung cancer


The smoke enters your lungs and causes you to have lung cancer. Lung cancer is the leading cancer deaths among women.



SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?


Would You Smoke a Cigarette if you knew...


Cigarette smoke contains over 4,800 chemicals, 69 of which are known to cause cancer. Some these chemicals include... *Benzene-(petrol additive)- derived from coal & petroleum (you know, what you put in your car?) *Formaldehyde-(enbalming fluid)-used to perserve DEAD bodies (if you have ever dissected before, it's that nasty scent that comes out of the specimen) *Ammonia-(toilet cleaner)-used for flavoring *Acetone-(nail polish cleaner)-fragrant volatile liquid, used as a solvent *Arsenic-(rat poisoning) *Butane-(lighter fluid) *Lead-(used in batteries and pencils) And my personal favorite... *Nepathelene-(the key ingredient in MOTH BALLS)

If that isn't enough to ban smoking around the entire planet, then I hope that this will... The list of diseases caused by cigarette smoking includes... *Chronic Obstructive pulmonary diesease *Coronary Heart Diesease *Bladder Cancer *Esophageal Cancer *Laryngeal Cancer *Lung Cancer *Oral Cancer *Throat Cancer *Cervical, Cancer *Kidney Cancer *Stomach Cancer *Pancreatic Cancer *Peptic Ulcer Diesease



SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?


Slippery Slope of overzealousness in other words "Nanny State"


Making smoking illegal is about as much "nannying" people as making heroin illegal. During the 1800's, opium was legal, many people were addicted to it and spent large amounts of their income on inhaling the fumes. This applied throughout society from the rich to the poor. As a result the growing and marketing of opium poppies and their products was outlawed (This step was not taken until well after 1900, the opium trade was well developed by then). This was not considered nannying people, but rather a step to better society by trying to eliminate a habit that could destroy lives. Whilst smoking is not as expensive as opium was, it still takes a significant amount of money from people who can't afford it, and inhibits their ability to develop as people.

Banning smoking would be a yet another slippery slope down the road of overzealousness leading to a nanny state if we aren't in one already. Given that a significant amount teachers and schools are chafing at the bit because of health and safety regulations and worrying about. What's next alcohol? There are some groups calling for that to happen, does the government ban alcohol with all the consequences that would bring.


What do you think?  Vote on this point below.
Absolutely Yes
Strongly Yes
Mostly Yes
Partially Yes
Neutral
Partially No
Mostly No
Strongly No
Absolutely No

SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?


The taxes on cigarettes help fund this country


There is a phrase that that applies to this: "ill gotten gains". Think about it literally we are getting money from people who are buying something that is addictive and harmful to their and other people's health . Admittedly we do the same by taxing alcohol (whether we're in the UK or US) and spirits but if they are drunk in moderation then they have positive effects outweighing the negative ones.

Cigarettes have like a 2 dollar tax, assuming that even if 20,000,000 people in the USA alone smoke, thats 40,000,000 dollars every time they buy a pack a cigarette.


What do you think?  Vote on this point below.
Absolutely Yes
Strongly Yes
Mostly Yes
Partially Yes
Neutral
Partially No
Mostly No
Strongly No
Absolutely No

SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?


Cigarettes are just as bad as cars.


A fair point but the chemicals in an "average" cigarette add to the effect of the CO2. We have measures to reduce CO2 emissions from cars and there are things called catalytic so why aren't we trying to reduce the harmful effects of chemicals from cigarettes down to a minimal level.

Oh and nicotine is a poisonous drug in it's own right. Farmers use it to kill bugs and three or four cigarettes worth of it or a single large drop would be enough to kill a person[1]. Why should we say a drug that effectively partially enslaves and kills is just as bad as your average motor or a Toyota Prius when it serves no purpose only to hook a person to their death or until they can get out again. Let me make it clear Nicotine is far worse than a Toyota Prius or your average car.
  1. ^ National Institute on Drug Abuse "Nida for Teens" http://teens.drugabuse.gov/facts/facts_nicotine1.php and Ann Meeker O Conell How Nicotine Works" How Stuff Works p7http://health.howstuffworks.com/nicotine7.htm

Walking outside in a polluted city like San Francisco or Karachi or LA or a city in china(16 of the world's most polluted cities are in China)[1], you are already damaging your lungs from all the CO(carbon monoxide fumes) put in the air from car emissions and all the people exhaling Carbon Dioxide(why are very polluted BIG cities, very populated too? people use cars and aeroplanes/airplanes(used by people vacationing to places with cleaner air and traveling businessmen) which cause a lot more pollution than cars[2]). Cigarettes release chemicals that are bad of course, but they are a preferable means of getting your smoke. Electronic vaporizing cigarettes do not produce second hand smoke and are hugely unpopular but won't be for long. It's better to be the smoker than to be the person whose face is being smoked into(statistically passive smokers are at a greater risk) .

  1. ^ http://www.time.com/time/specials/2007/article/0,28804,1661031_1661028,00.html
  2. ^ http://www.ehponline.org/qa/105-12focus/focus.html


What do you think?  Vote on this point below.
Absolutely Yes
Strongly Yes
Mostly Yes
Partially Yes
Neutral
Partially No
Mostly No
Strongly No
Absolutely No

SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?


It would never work


Evidence suggests that in spite of possible practical difficulties of the smoking ban in pubs and bars, it has been a considerable success: if we are to believe Health dept. figures, 400,000 people quit smoking as a result of the ban being brought in ^1^. Further evidence suggests that in previous discussions, wider enforcement has been seen to be more practical than narrower enforcement: in the case of the current smoking ban, evidence from a Camden subcommittee opposed initial plans to restrict smoking bans to only those pubs and bars serving food, on the basis of enforcement difficulties ^2^. If precedent is anything to go by - and it as least as good as unsubstantiated common sense - an outright ban might be quite easily enforced.

^1^ http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/7480856.stm

^2^ http://www3.camden.gov.uk/templates/committees/documents/14971.doc

It's a great idea but in practice how would it work? Taking them out of the shops will leave greater problems since many people smoke because they are addicted and not because they enjoy it.

Making something illegal is of course easier than it seems. We must weigh in not only the reasons why, but also how are we going to implement a certain set of provision. We have to realise that making something illegal does not automatically solve a problem, instead it might create even more problems as a repercussion to such a decision.

Making illicit drugs such as heroine, cocaine, etc. was agreeably a good decision. However, the consequences of making such commendable decisions also involve the allocation of large amounts of state resources (read: tax payer money) to combat illegal drug trafficking. Apparently, making these drugs illegal did not really stop people from using the drugs (fyi: drugs are still a lucrative business, if not why would people risk their lives to smuggle it). That said, the same goes for cigarettes, I don't see any strong reason that making cigarettes (or smoking them) illegal to be of any use in the context of making people quit the bad habit.

People who smoke are addicted to it, and as those people who are addicted to illicit drugs, they will always find ways to circumvent the law. Making smoking illegal does not automatically make the business less profitable. As I see it, the demand for cigarettes are still high everywhere, and this kind of policy would only create "black markets" for the item. This in turn would put burden on the law enforcement to combat such black markets (read: more personnel, more funds needed), and of course these burdens would be passed on to tax payers who pays for all the cost of faithfully enforcing such a new law.

I believe that the restrictions and requirements which are already in place (i.e. restricting smoking areas, limited advertisement methods) are sufficient enough to tackle the problem. Moreover, the current approach is right on track where the government should sponsor and support policies that would decrease the demand for cigarettes (if the demand for cigarettes were to fall substantially, the business would be less lucrative, and soon enough nobody will be in the cigarette business). This is not a policy that would effectively reduce the demand, simply making it illegal is not addressing to the demand problem.Thus, what I see in this is another burden for the state budget, with little or minimal impact on the real issue at hand.


What do you think?  Vote on this point below.
Absolutely Yes
Strongly Yes
Mostly Yes
Partially Yes
Neutral
Partially No
Mostly No
Strongly No
Absolutely No

SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?


John Stuart Mill - the principles of power and harm in Liberal Democracy


Then why are drugs illegal? Obviously, the government has a duty to protect it's citizens from things that will definitely harm them.

"That the only purpose for which power can be rightfully exercised over any member of a civilized community, against his will, is to prevent harm to others. His own good, either physical or moral, is not a sufficient warrant. He cannot rightfully be compelled to do or forbear because it will be better for him to do so, because it will make him happier, because, in the opinions of others, to do so would be wise, or even right. These are good reasons for remonstrating with him, or reasoning with him, or persuading him, or entreating him, but not for compelling him, or visiting him with any evil, in case he do otherwise. ... Over himself, over his own body and mind, the individual is sovereign."[1]

The principle that only those actions which harm others should be legislated against is being eroded by legislation on obesity and narcotics in particular. Certainly, it is true that there is an extent to which something such as smoking falls into the category, for it has demonstrable negative effects on others in certain cases. However, these are the cases that have already been legislated against with the ban on smoking in public, indoor places. At the point at which the extension of the ban on smoking crosses the line from protecting others to controlling the behaviour of the individual, it transgresses the principles upon which a liberal democratic society is based
  1. ^ J. S. Mill, Utilitarianism, 1859. Chapter 1. see http://www.utilitarianism.com/ol/one.html


What do you think?  Vote on this point below.
Absolutely Yes
Strongly Yes
Mostly Yes
Partially Yes
Neutral
Partially No
Mostly No
Strongly No
Absolutely No

SHOULD SMOKING BE MADE ILLEGAL?


The buying and selling of tobacco products should not be made illegal


Public smoking IS illegal in Countries in the U.K, a host of other Countries and now Pakistan. Making smoking illegal should on paper decrease smoking considerably and dealing with 'BLACK MARKET' is the law enforcement's job.

The buying and selling of tobacco products should not be made illegal (as the sale of drugs has). There is no paucity in pot-smoking college students, even though the transaction is illegal. American tycoons smoke Cuban cigars despite the law in their Country. Making the sale/purchase of cigarettes/pipes/cigars/etc illegal will (as in the case of illegal narcotics) only give rise to the boom of a black market for these products , thus crime(Theft, murder and smuggling). Also, the hate (for self and others), guilt (for doing something illegal) and desperation (from addiction, loss/test of self-control and the inability to come clean/get rehabilitated without legal prosecution) will most naturally lead to a host of psychological/psychiatric problems (Prozac nation), followed by more crime(increased suicide-rate, theft etc). However, the public use and abuse of such products SHOULD be illegal. This will permit people who choose not to smoke, to avert the health risks of passive smoking. The black market will NOT emerge, since transactions (buying and selling of tobacco products) will be legal (and the black market having to incur added costs would be unable to compete with legal prices). Smokers restricted from public circles/events will have the incentive to get rehabilitation and work towards losing the habit. Once public smoking is illegal smokers might even take the health concern seriously.


What do you think?  Vote on this point below.
Absolutely Yes
Strongly Yes
Mostly Yes
Partially Yes
Neutral
Partially No
Mostly No
Strongly No
Absolutely No


Vote on the overall debate: Should smoking be made illegal?

What do you think?  Vote on this debate below.
Absolutely Yes
Strongly Yes
Mostly Yes
Partially Yes
Neutral
Partially No
Mostly No
Strongly No
Absolutely No
1. Eliminates a public health menace
# 1

Let's face facts smoking is a public health hazard whether it's. The damage done to lungs and other internal organs in the form of cancer and other diseases is well documented. It's a dangerous drug and it's high time it was treated as a narcotic and banned

Leo A Capella

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11:38, 17 June 09

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Karma Score: 1826


# 2

Smoking is a hazard but its effects are massively overstated by the smoking lobby. For instance although lung cancer affects "0.01"% of non smokers smoking increases the likelihood of a person who started smoking in their teens have a chance of developing lung cancer at 2% if they stop at 30 and 16% if they stop at 70[1] Also smoking could potentially help protect against Alzheimers disease as well as reduce stress something that can cause just as much serious problems for people as smoking does.[2]

Secondly it pays its way so to speak, the UK treasury gets an estimated £8,000 million from revenues that's money that can go towards hospitals schools etc[3]. Why take away a good source of revenue that can help?
  1. ^ Forest "Smoking and Health"http://www.forestonline.org/output/Smoking-and-Health.aspx Accessed 19.06.2009
  2. ^ Forest "Smoking and Health"http://www.forestonline.org/output/Smoking-and-Health.aspx Accessed 19.06.2009
  3. ^ Ash http://www.ash.org.uk/files/documents/ASH_95.pdf Accessed

Leo A Capella

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06:00, 19 June 09

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Karma Score: 1826



2. Being regulated out of existence anyway
# 1

The tobacco industry and opportunities to get cigarettes are running out of options anyway. For example tobacco companies can't advertise or sponsor events. They can not

Leo A Capella

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11:44, 17 June 09

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Karma Score: 1826


# 2

Just because something is heavily taxed and regulated doesn't make the activity wrong and the regulations on it working it right. The high taxes on smoking force people some people to buy illicitly whether in the form of smuggled cigarettes from France something that hits the treasury to the amount of £2 billion a year or fraud cigarettes.[1]
  1. ^ Action on smoking and health (ash) "Facts at a glance " [[http://www.ash.org.uk/files/documents/ASH_95.pdf

Leo A Capella

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06:11, 19 June 09

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Karma Score: 1826



3. Class exploitation
# 1

Smoking and the industry just like the narcotics industry are a form of class warfare. As tobacco advertising is being banned in the UK companies are heading towards less economically developed countries

Leo A Capella

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12:12, 17 June 09

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Karma Score: 1826


# 2

The Health secretary who was present when the ban was enacted, John Reid famously said it "was wrong for middle class politicians to ban what for many working class people was their only pleasure".[1] This means an outright ban on smoking far from being an act of liberating people would be tightening the screw on an already strained working class by a puritanical middle class nanny state.[2].
  1. ^ http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/3789591.stm
  2. ^ Patrick Wintour http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2005/oct/27/smoking.health1

Leo A Capella

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08:14, 22 June 09

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Karma Score: 1826



4. YES.
# 1

Smoking does not just effect the smokers health, it effects the people around them. Just because they want to damage their health doesn't mean they should damage ours.

sophie-lauretta

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08:02, 03 July 09

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Karma Score: 13


# 2

That would certainly be an argument for regulating the circumstances in which people can smoke, like, for example, the law in Ireland that bans smoking in enclosed workplaces. But so long as smokers don't "smoke in someone's face" then they should not be prevented for enjoying a cigarette if they so choose.

Ataxia

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11:04, 05 July 09

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Karma Score: 10



5. Damaging health
# 1

Smoking is a very bad habit.It has many bad side effects.it causes many fatal diseases like bronchitis,liver censer,blood cancer, breathing problems etc.which can kill people.It also causes heart related diseases.It makes infections in the internal side of our body.Because of it every year about 50,000-1,00,000 people dies in the world.It has tobacco in it which is very very dangerous for human health.Sometimes it gets harder to breath for the smokers.It also can be dangerous for the friends & family of a smoker.As a Substantiation we can take the matter of Hafiz who is a student of CTG. university.(-THE DAILY AJADY)..He died last year in censer because of smoking.Smoke made his liver infected.So he died with an unbearable pain.Like Hafiz there are so many people are dying.So we should take necessary steps to make people live.We should make smoking illegal.

Mustafa

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10:16, 10 July 09

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Karma Score: 43


# 2

It is the case that smoking is an unhealthy habit, and that it harms the smoker and those physically close to the smoker when they are smoking. But that's no argument for a government-enforced ban on smoking. Eating fast food is unhealthy, so is it up to the government to shut down all fast food restaurants? Drinking alcohol is unhealthy, and many innocent bystanders are harmed as an effect of drunk behavior (drinking and driving, drunken arguments, etc), is it up to the government in that case to eradicate all alcohol from the country? Of course not. In all of these cases, it is up to the individual to make the decision for their own health. As for preventing secondhand smoke, smoking regulations enforced by the government, ie smoking is not allowed within 50 feet of a public building or inside the workplace, etc, seem to be a good idea. But there's no need for complete government control of tobacco products/cigarettes.

terrifictara

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17:49, 14 July 09

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Karma Score: 10



6. fred fredburger
# 1

Yes

fred fredburger

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20:04, 05 October 09

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Karma Score: 7


# 2

this guy is dumb

fred fredburger

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20:09, 05 October 09

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Karma Score: 7



7. Can cause Lung cancer
# 1

The smoke enters your lungs and causes you to have lung cancer. Lung cancer is the leading cancer deaths among women.

skylaces1234

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22:30, 19 October 09

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Karma Score: 3



8. Kill
# 1

kills 1200 people a day

1234321

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18:29, 08 February 10

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Karma Score: 6



9. Would You Smoke a Cigarette if you knew...
# 1

Cigarette smoke contains over 4,800 chemicals, 69 of which are known to cause cancer. Some these chemicals include... *Benzene-(petrol additive)- derived from coal & petroleum (you know, what you put in your car?) *Formaldehyde-(enbalming fluid)-used to perserve DEAD bodies (if you have ever dissected before, it's that nasty scent that comes out of the specimen) *Ammonia-(toilet cleaner)-used for flavoring *Acetone-(nail polish cleaner)-fragrant volatile liquid, used as a solvent *Arsenic-(rat poisoning) *Butane-(lighter fluid) *Lead-(used in batteries and pencils) And my personal favorite... *Nepathelene-(the key ingredient in MOTH BALLS)

If that isn't enough to ban smoking around the entire planet, then I hope that this will... The list of diseases caused by cigarette smoking includes... *Chronic Obstructive pulmonary diesease *Coronary Heart Diesease *Bladder Cancer *Esophageal Cancer *Laryngeal Cancer *Lung Cancer *Oral Cancer *Throat Cancer *Cervical, Cancer *Kidney Cancer *Stomach Cancer *Pancreatic Cancer *Peptic Ulcer Diesease

katiem1021

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17:11, 28 February 10

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Karma Score: 12



1. Slippery Slope of overzealousness in other words "Nanny State"
# 1

Banning smoking would be a yet another slippery slope down the road of overzealousness. Given that a significant amount teachers and schools are chafing at the bit because of health and safety regulations and worrying about. What's next alcohol? There are some groups calling for that to happen, does the government ban alcohol with all the consequences.

Leo A Capella

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07:36, 19 June 09

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Karma Score: 1826


# 2

Making smoking illegal is about as much "nannying" people as making heroine illegal. During the 1800's, opium was legal, many people were addicted to it and spent large amounts of their income on inhaling the fumes. This applied throughout society from the rich to the poor. As a result the growing and marketing of opium poppies and their products was outlawed (This step was not taken until well after 1900, the opium trade was well developed by then). This was not considered nannying people, rather a step to better society by trying to eliminate a habit that could destroy lives. Whilst smoking is not as expensive as opium was, it still takes a significant amount of money from people who can't afford it, and inhibits their ability to develop as people.

Joey

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07:04, 27 June 09

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Karma Score: 56



2. The taxes on cigarettes help fund this country
# 1

Cigarettes have like a 2 dollar tax, assuming that even if 20,000,000 people in the USA alone smoke, thats 40,000,000 dollars every time they buy a pack a cigarette.

Fuckscientology

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17:32, 20 June 09

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Karma Score: 18


# 2

There is a phrase that that applies to this: "ill gotten gains". Think about it literally we are getting money from people who are buying something that is addictive and . Admittedly we do the same by taxing alcohol (whether we're in the UK or US) and spirits but if they are drunk in moderation then they have positive effects outweighing the negative ones.

Leo A Capella

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08:18, 22 June 09

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Karma Score: 1826



3. Cigarettes are just as bad as cars.
# 1

Walking outside being in a populated city like San Fran or LA, you are already damaging your lungs from all the CO put in the air from car emissions. Cigarettes release chemicals that are bad of course, but there are alternate means of getting your nicotine the healthy way. Like electronic vaporizing cigarettes. That dont produce second hand smoke.

Fuckscientology

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17:35, 20 June 09

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Karma Score: 18


# 2

A fair point but the chemicals in an "average" cigarette add to the effect of the CO2. We have measures to reduce CO2 emissions from cars and there are things called catalytic so why aren't we trying to reduce the harmful effects of chemicals from cigarettes down to a minimal level.

Oh and nicotine is a poisonous drug in it's own right. Farmers use it to kill bugs and three or four cigarettes worth of it or a single large drop would be enough to kill a person[1]. Why should we say a drug that effectively partially enslaves and kills is just as bad as your average motor or a Toyota Prius when it serves no purpose only to hook a person to their death or until they can get out again. Let me make it clear Nicotine is far worse than a Toyota Prius or your average car.
  1. ^ National Institute on Drug Abuse "Nida for Teens" http://teens.drugabuse.gov/facts/facts_nicotine1.php and Ann Meeker O Conell How Nicotine Works" How Stuff Works p7http://health.howstuffworks.com/nicotine7.htm

Leo A Capella

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08:39, 22 June 09

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Karma Score: 1826



4. It would never work
# 1

It's a great idea but in practice how would it work? Taking them out of the shops will leave greater problems since many people smoke because they are addicted and not because they enjoy it.

tiggerstar77

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06:53, 29 June 09

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Karma Score: 10


# 2

Evidence suggests that in spite of possible practical difficulties of the smoking ban in pubs and bars, it has been a considerable success: if we are to believe Health dept. figures, 400,000 people quit smoking as a result of the ban being brought in ^1^. Further evidence suggests that in previous discussions, wider enforcement has been seen to be more practical than narrower enforcement: in the case of the current smoking ban, evidence from a Camden subcommittee opposed initial plans to restrict smoking bans to only those pubs and bars serving food, on the basis of enforcement difficulties ^2^. If precedent is anything to go by, and it as least as good as unsubstantiated common sense, and extended ban may quite easily enforced.

^1^ http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/7480856.stm

^2^ http://www3.camden.gov.uk/templates/committees/documents/14971.doc

debatewiserichard

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17:55, 01 July 09

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Karma Score: 52



5. John Stuart Mill - the principles of power and harm in Liberal Democracy
# 1

"That the only purpose for which power can be rightfully exercised over any member of a civilized community, against his will, is to prevent harm to others. His own good, either physical or moral, is not a sufficient warrant. He cannot rightfully be compelled to do or forbear because it will be better for him to do so, because it will make him happier, because, in the opinions of others, to do so would be wise, or even right. These are good reasons for remonstrating with him, or reasoning with him, or persuading him, or entreating him, but not for compelling him, or visiting him with any evil, in case he do otherwise. ... Over himself, over his own body and mind, the individual is sovereign."[1]

The principle that only those actions which harm others should be legislated against is being eroded by legislation on obesity and narcotics in particular. Certainly, it is true that there is an extent to which something such as smoking falls into the category, for it has demonstrable negative effects on others in certain cases. However, these are the cases that have already been legislated against with the ban on smoking in public, indoor places. At the point at which the extension of the ban on smoking crosses the line from protecting others to controlling the behaviour of the individual, it transgresses the principles upon which a liberal democratic society is based
  1. ^ J. S. Mill, Utilitarianism, 1859. Chapter 1. see http://www.utilitarianism.com/ol/one.html

debatewiserichard

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18:06, 01 July 09

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Karma Score: 52


# 2

Then why are drugs illegal? Obviously, the government has a duty to protect it's citizens from things that will definitely harm them.

David

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06:36, 12 July 09

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Karma Score: 373



6. The buying and selling of tobacco products should not be made illegal
# 1

The buying and selling of tobacco products should not be made illegal (as the sale of drugs has). There is no paucity in pot-smoking college students, even though the transaction is illegal. American tycoons smoke Cuban cigars despite the law in their Country. Making the sale/purchase of cigarettes/pipes/cigars/etc illegal will (as in the case of illegal narcotics) only give rise to the boom of a black market for these products , thus crime(Theft, murder and smuggling). Also, the hate (for self and others), guilt (for doing something illegal) and desperation (from addiction, loss/test of self-control and the inability to come clean/get rehabilitated without legal prosecution) will most naturally lead to a host of psychological/psychiatric problems (Prozac nation), followed by more crime(increased suicide-rate, theft etc). However, the public use and abuse of such products SHOULD be illegalized. This will permit people who choose not to smoke, to avert the health risks of passive smoking. The black market will NOT emerge, since transactions (buying and selling of tobacco products) will be legal (and the black market having to incur added costs would be unable to compete with legal prices). Smokers restricted from public circles/events will have the incentive to get rehabilitation and work towards losing the habit. Once public smoking is illegal smokers might even take the health concern seriously.

NADIA999

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00:20, 12 August 09

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Karma Score: 5609


# 2

Public smoking IS illegal in Countries in the U.K, a host of other Countries and now Pakistan. Making smoking illegal should on paper decrease smoking considerably and dealing with 'BLACK MARKET' is the law enforcement's job.

NADIA999

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00:26, 12 August 09

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Karma Score: 5609


# 3

Dealing with a black market maybe law enforcement's job but isn't it the state's responsibility to avoid the formation of a black market ?

Leo A Capella

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18:13, 21 August 09

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Karma Score: 1826



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