Modified:
03 Feb 2010
by Booji
Vote totals:
Yes:
50%
No:
50%
Neutral:
0%
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DEBATE: ISLAMIC FUNDAMENTALIST A FREEDOM FIGHTER, JEHADIST AND A TERRORIST!?
Posted by: SouthAsian
Karma:
48
Pakistan perfected the use of Islamic Fundamentalism as a weapon in Afganistan and uses it in Kashmir for the past 25 years. Now that weapon has turned rogue, Fundamentalists want control over all of Pakistan. It is time for Pakistani State to act responsibly towards the whole world and its own citizens by expunging support to all religious, political and governmental organisations on its soil which propose violence as a means of achieving power. Pakistan cannot name the Islamic Fundamentalist a Freedom Fighter/Jehadist in Kashmir, Mumbai and New York, but a Terrorist in Karachi/Quetta.
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All the No points
ISLAMIC FUNDAMENTALIST A FREEDOM FIGHTER, JEHADIST AND A TERRORIST!?
Dysfunctional State?!
To clarify certain facts to Nadia, who appears ignorant of what is South Asia Asia:-INDIA
1. Gujarat is a state/province within the Union of India.
2. India is a secular state.
3. The father of Indian missle programme is a muslim!
5. India has had two muslim persidents!
6. The President of India is the supreme commander of the armed forces of India!
7. More muslims live in India than in Pakistan!
8. Muslim soldiers of the Indian Army fought Pakistan in Kargil!
9. The Indian Parliament controls the Indian Army and not the other way round!
10. India never has had ANY military dictators in all its 63 years of existence!
11. General elections are the ONLY method of power change in India for all its 63 years of exisitence!
12. Indian judiciary is not based on any religion!
11. Indians do not hate muslims, muslims are Indians!!PAKISTAN
1. Pakistan is a theocratic state and not secular.
2. Pakistan has been a military dictatorship for 33 yrs of its 63 years of existence!
3. Pakistan has islamic law practiced in its courts.
4. Pakistan has never had a person of minority faith in a position of authority in the government or its political parties.
5. Pakistani Army is a constant threat to any civilian government.
6. Pakistan is threatened by Islamic fundamentalists, who want to establish an ultra orthodox islamic caliphate in Pakistan.
7. Pakistan possesses nuclear weapons...
8. The mullah and the bomb...not a very good combination.........
The reletive state of India and Pakistan matter little to a question of whether fighters are terrorists or freedom fighters. Does being a democracy mean that whoever you support are freedom fighters? I dont think so. Essentially when it comes to foreign policy both democracies and dictatorships tend to act with the national interst in mind, if this means encouraging 'freedom fighters' then they will. It is however these differences that prevents India from supporting such freedom fighters in Pakistan. Pakistan has little to worry about from slightly destabilising India (assuming that it is not seen to be the cause resulting in a conflict) however India has a lot to lose from further destabilising Pakistan. As an already unstable state further destabilistation might result in Pakistan becomming a failed state. This could have numerous consequences for india... mostly pretty bad.Particularly that Pakistan might turn into a theocratic state (you say it already is and then that it might be turned into one... I think it is not yet). As to the mullah and the bomb being bad, as yet we have no evidence that they will not be detered like everyone else - there is no point in an islamic state if you are going to get it blown sky high in a nuclear conflict with India. We should remember that the only users of the bomb so far has been a democracy and that supposedly radical states such as Maoist China have been very rational in their nuclear policies.
What do you think? Vote on this point below.
ISLAMIC FUNDAMENTALIST A FREEDOM FIGHTER, JEHADIST AND A TERRORIST!?
yeah, because there is no such thing as the Afghsan Taliban or the former taliban govt in Afghanistan
The Pakistani authorities/govt never 'condoned' the 9/11 attacks or the Mumbai attacks.(Though the U.C.L.A Berkeley educated miss Pakistan did say condone instead of condemn on C.N.N, of course if you watch the rest of her interview you understand she obviously meant'condemn'. So this tirade/chiding makes no sense but I guess since Pakistan is already on the right track in these terms this counts as a yes point.Yes Pakistan shouldn't call terrorists in India and America, jihadis or freedom fighters and um doesn't?
or the the American funded Mujahideen (who spawned rather reinvented themselves into the Taliban) or alternatively R.A.W, the C.I.A and/or the I.S.I; with their (un)humanitarian operations/methods and dealing propounding/piling-up evidence/support for the Taliban cause(if not providing weapons/funding to the Taliban)
(note sarcasm)Nobody is sacrosanct and to thrust blame onto Pakistan alone or making unfounded accusations against the Pakistani government without proof is falling deeply into the trap of conspiracy theorizing and not conducive to fruitful/rational debate.
What do you think? Vote on this point below.
ISLAMIC FUNDAMENTALIST A FREEDOM FIGHTER, JEHADIST AND A TERRORIST!?
there have been less than secular attacks/violence/incidences against religious minorities in India
India's place in this matter is irrelevant since it is a debate on Pakistan's loyalties, saying that Indians aren't that great does not exonerate Pakistan from blame.[1]
South Asian has a fairly prejudiced/Pakistan-hating 'Indian' standpoint and should probably be identified by the word 'Indian' and not South Asian since Pakistanis who don't share the views presented by 'South Asian' are also south Asians.Anyway prejudiced Indian, the Indian army's actions against the civilians of Jammu are not a pretty sight to behold. Battles/wars are fought two ways: are two sided, and where Pakistani soldiers die fighting, Indian soldiers also die 'fighting'. And technically Jammu is India's and Kashmir is Pakistan's.Point being: accusing the other side of playing dirty/breaking-the-rules/cheating when you yourself are in no position to judge is not going to win you any accolades/favours/kudos.'let he who is free of sin,cast the first stone'[1]
What do you think? Vote on this point below.
ISLAMIC FUNDAMENTALIST A FREEDOM FIGHTER, JEHADIST AND A TERRORIST!?
By the same count; U.S is to blame for non-arrests of certain Al-queda operatives, mainly because it has had access to Pakistani soil and air space for a very long time slot, that continues to span
Pakistan is to blame as hundreds of Al-Queda operatives reside on the Pak-afghan border. The U.S condemns terrorism in Pakistan and approves aid to Pakistan to fight it with the U.S intelligence and soldiers; but does not condemn her own actions(though international humanitarian organisations do) taking civilian lives on the ground and from air strikes in the name of 'collateral damage'.[1]Why are, after all the blood shed(thousands dying in Waziristan), a few hundred Al-Queda operatives not caught?
There are a spate of articles on the net propagating and entertaining the view that when an operative does not get caught; Pakistani authorities(dying in large numbers, fighting the taliban and Al queda), who have handed over air/land space to American military forces; are to blame.The idea is preposterous given the fact that I reiterate: U.S forces have had the freedom to blow up civilian masses from land(infamous drone attacks) and air for many years and counting. Pakistan has given up lives of soldiers & civilians; has caught chief operatives, the celebrity captive being 'Khalid Sheikh Mohd"[1]
and continues to cooperate in terms of giving up land and air space to the U.S combatants and it's sad the disinformation the western(with the exception of the BBC and CNN) and Indian media like to propagate to enrage political minorities short on facts.
What do you think? Vote on this point below.
ISLAMIC FUNDAMENTALIST A FREEDOM FIGHTER, JEHADIST AND A TERRORIST!?
how you label someone depends on how they treat YOU
from the title of the debate this should be an yes point but all the pro-pakistan points are on this side for some reason?a silly little analogy then:lets say a family member of mine is constantly rude to my next door neighbor. but causes my own family no trouble. in this case they are an enemy of my neighbor. they are not not an enemy of me. hence they can stay with me anytime, my house is open. of course, if this family member ASSAULTED my neighbor then it would become a different story. i would have to turn them over to the police.but if it is SOMEONE ELSE who assaulted the neighbor then just because my family member ASSOCIATES with the criminal or shares the same bad opinions about the neighbor as the criminal, this does not obligate me to turn them over to the police or kick them out of my house. until proven guilty as an individual, they are my family and i treat them accordingly.however if the neighbor genuinely feels threatened and wants to press charges against my family member for whatever reason, they have the right to do so and it would be my duty to provide honest information for the sake of justice.i hope that makes sense.
Vote on the overall debate: Islamic Fundamentalist a Freedom Fighter, Jehadist and a Terrorist!?
What do you think? Vote on this debate below.
SouthAsian
|19:55, 18 January 10
|Karma Score: 48
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booji
|12:21, 03 February 10
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NADIA999
|12:00, 16 January 10
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NADIA999
|12:17, 16 January 10
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NADIA999
|12:12, 16 January 10
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NADIA999
|03:38, 17 January 10
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NADIA999
|03:34, 17 January 10
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NADIA999
|03:43, 17 January 10
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yxmyxm
|09:58, 17 January 10
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